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[07:48:12 EDT(-0400)] * athena7 (n=athena7@c-24-2-189-230.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) has joined ##uportal
[08:38:49 EDT(-0400)] * MarkRogers (n=MarkRoge@addhcp129.cc.umanitoba.ca) has joined ##uportal
[09:06:51 EDT(-0400)] * michelled (n=team@142.150.154.197) has joined ##uportal
[09:28:39 EDT(-0400)] * EricDalquist (n=EricDalq@adsl-76-208-70-100.dsl.mdsnwi.sbcglobal.net) has joined ##uportal
[09:29:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> FYI: there is a wisclist outage: http://kb.wisc.edu/helpdesk/outage.php?action=5&amp;caseID=080515-0091
[09:29:23 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> test ...
[09:29:46 EDT(-0400)] * EricDalquist (n=EricDalq@adsl-76-208-70-100.dsl.mdsnwi.sbcglobal.net) has joined ##uportal
[09:30:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh sad
[09:30:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> no email (sad)
[09:30:59 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[09:31:07 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I was wondering why my inbox was quiet
[09:31:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I think 95% of my email comes via wisclist
[09:31:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah things seemed quiet this morning but i figured it was early still
[09:31:31 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> including outage notices ironically
[09:31:36 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> since for me it's just the jasig stuff
[09:31:39 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh, lol
[09:32:01 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the only reason I though to check is I sent an email to uportal-user that hadn't shown up
[09:32:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah last time we had a campus network outage we had some complaints from other departments in IT because the portal wasn't showing the ITS status messages about it
[09:32:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm like no, it's not that we're not trying
[09:32:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lol
[09:32:41 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> but the portal relies on the network being functional to be able to get those messages . . .
[09:32:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> brb
[09:33:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> k
[09:57:23 EDT(-0400)] * anastasiac (n=team@142.150.154.105) has joined ##uportal
[10:13:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oi ... having the carpets cleaned at home today and I'm having fun moving stuff ...
[10:15:10 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> where is developer.ja-sig.org host? UWisc?
[10:15:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> princeton hosts all of the ja-sig.org/uportal.org stuff
[10:15:31 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I meant "hosted"
[10:15:40 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> thanks
[10:15:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> something wrong with it?
[10:16:23 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> nope
[10:17:06 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> just curious as it was a little slow this morning when doing an ant deploy-ear and I had to look at it on my screen (smile)
[10:17:16 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ah
[10:22:26 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'm going to write a wiki page on how to change host names with cas
[10:22:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> detail each spot it needs changing
[10:23:18 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> ldap hosts?
[10:23:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> no
[10:23:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> what host/port your portal is listening on
[10:23:45 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the ldap stuff we need to get figured out too
[10:23:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> brb
[10:32:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> that sounds like a good idea
[10:32:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i think some of that stuff is still pretty undocumented in the manual
[10:32:27 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> Mark emailed me his config files
[10:32:31 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> several problems
[10:32:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'm checking to see if it is ok to reply to uportal-user with the answers
[10:32:43 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ldap config files?
[10:32:47 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ahh
[10:32:47 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[10:32:59 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> he has local AND local&ldap configs uncomments
[10:33:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and the ldap names don't match what is in ldapcontext
[10:33:12 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[10:33:48 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> wait which ldap files were these?
[10:34:05 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> do you mean "Kevin", Eric?
[10:34:54 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> Kevin Thompson, one of the guys on the user list with ldap problems
[10:35:01 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> security.properties and ldapContext.xml
[10:35:23 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> ah, yes said Mark (wink)
[10:35:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oops
[10:35:48 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> type one thing think another ... I'm good at that
[10:36:14 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> kinda like typing "yes" when you mean "you" (wink)
[10:38:13 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yippee
[10:38:33 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I got my LDAPish stuff to work
[10:38:47 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> cool
[10:39:10 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> my problem must have been related to SSL
[10:39:49 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i was trying to authenticate against Novell eDirectory which requires an LDAPS connection unless you allow clear text passwords
[10:39:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah ok
[10:40:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah i figured it was a bean config problem if it wasn't even starting up
[10:40:05 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> so I set up an OpenDS server on my Mac, and BAM
[10:40:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ahh
[10:40:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> uPortal should be able to do ldapds
[10:40:37 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ldaps*
[10:40:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[10:40:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i think if you configure it to use ldaps and the correct port it should work
[10:40:56 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> if it doesn't, that's something we should look into
[10:41:10 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I think it was that problem with the server certificate needing to be recognized by the JVM
[10:41:12 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> just guessing
[10:41:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> if the server has a self-signed cert you'll probably need to import that into your jvm too
[10:41:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah
[10:41:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[10:41:40 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ah
[10:41:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> if that turns out to be the case you can always use keytool to pull it in
[10:41:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[10:41:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and the jdk keytool is a pain in the but
[10:42:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> where is the keystore on a mac, anyway?
[10:42:27 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> not even sure that my eDirectory server has a self-signed certificate
[10:42:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> no idea
[10:42:51 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it must have something if it's doing ssl?
[10:45:09 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I'll ask
[10:47:20 EDT(-0400)] * holdorph (n=holdorph@wsip-98-174-242-39.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined ##uportal
[10:48:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> can you do something like s_client -connect ldapserver:port -showcerts ?
[10:49:48 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i think that should work against an ldap server, anyway
[10:50:08 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> what is s_client
[10:50:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> if it does, it'll print out the certificate that you would need to import
[10:50:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oops sorry - that'd be "openssl s_client -connect ldapserver:port -showcerts"
[10:51:30 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> well look at that
[10:51:57 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yes it does
[10:52:04 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> how do I import that?
[10:52:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> so if you take the certificate that gets printed out and save it to a file
[10:52:28 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> the part between begin and end certificate
[10:52:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> then use the jvm's keytool:
[10:52:44 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> okay, I see that
[10:54:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> argh
[10:54:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it ate my command
[10:54:44 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i can import it with Keychain Access on my Mac
[10:54:53 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> okay done
[10:55:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh ok, a mac
[10:55:15 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i was going to print out the command for using the jvm's keytool, but never mind (smile)
[10:56:03 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> it says that it is signed by an unknown authority, but I suppose that just means it wasn't Thawte or Verisign
[10:56:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> so if that successfully gets it in your keystore as a trusted certificate, that should be it
[10:56:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[10:56:19 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i haven't used the mac keychain access tool much
[10:56:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is there a way to tell it that you trust it?
[10:56:42 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> so I can try to change my ldap cas config back and try it
[10:56:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sounds good
[10:57:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> did you get an ssl error in the cas log before?
[10:58:11 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> no, nothing
[10:58:21 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i could only see that it had tried it
[10:58:34 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> and failed
[10:59:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> interesting, i'm a little surprised
[10:59:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i wonder if we might want to turn up logging a little in the default configuration
[10:59:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> or at least document how to do that
[11:01:43 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> can you do that?
[11:02:23 EDT(-0400)] * holdorph_ (n=holdorph@wsip-98-174-242-39.ph.ph.cox.net) has joined ##uportal
[11:02:59 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> turn up the logging? yes
[11:04:19 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> being a connoisseur of ldap errors, I would like to try that
[11:04:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> you need to add a new logj4.properties to uportal-portlets-overlay/cas/src/main/webapp/WEB-INF/log4j.properties
[11:04:42 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> just looked, and i think that's the right spot
[11:05:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> then run ant deploy-ear
[11:06:05 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> okay ... something is kinda slow today, but I'll try that later
[11:06:38 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> here's a dumb question (now that Cris has gone off-line and can't make fun of my Canuckness)
[11:07:08 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> when I do a deploy-ear, maven want to bring things to my local repository, right?
[11:07:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yes, if they aren't already there
[11:07:28 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> but some things, it seems to always want to download
[11:07:33 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[11:07:50 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> too bad Drew Wills isn't in here I could take a jab at him over this (wink)
[11:08:12 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so Cernunnos depends on some artifacts that only happen to be available in a Maven1 repository
[11:08:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> Maven1 repositories do not include the pom.xml files, just the artifacts
[11:08:37 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so since those pom.xml files are missing from you local repo
[11:08:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> maven tries to re-download them every time
[11:08:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> annoying
[11:08:56 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> can I manually put them there?
[11:09:01 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> they don't exist
[11:09:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> you could create stubs
[11:09:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> since you can deduce the groupId, artifactId and version
[11:09:24 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and place those there
[11:10:41 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> okay, I've gotten my eDir to work now too ... thanks to Jennifer
[11:12:19 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I used the fastldapbind in both cases
[11:15:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh good
[11:15:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is everything fixed now?
[11:16:04 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yes, I think so
[11:16:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yea!
[11:16:12 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm glad
[11:16:23 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and it's good to have someone test all this with ldaps too
[11:17:18 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i'm going to try to document this very simple case, including some of that keytool stuff
[11:18:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> wonderful (smile)
[11:18:28 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i created initial pages for the person dir stuff and uportal security context stuff
[11:18:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i don't think there's anything on the cas ldap configuration in the manual
[11:18:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and the stuff i wrote could probably use some more work
[11:19:01 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> the UPM30 manual?
[11:19:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[11:21:12 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> can you set xstream to just ignore any xml elements it doesn't have java mappings for?
[11:21:45 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oops
[11:21:53 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> just found out why Kevin's portal was failing to start
[11:22:00 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the example <alias name="studentLdapServer" alias="defaultLdapServer"/> I have in ldapContext.xml
[11:22:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the names are backwards
[11:22:10 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> well
[11:22:12 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> actually
[11:22:13 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> no they aren't
[11:22:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> they are just backwards in his version
[11:22:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ok
[11:22:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh (smile)
[11:22:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> going to write an email to the list
[11:22:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> that'd do it
[11:22:47 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> if he wants to use the security context, he's going to need to update to the trunk or pull in the patch
[11:22:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i don't think it will work in the GA
[11:22:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[11:23:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'm going to need to do 3.0.1 soon ....
[11:23:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[11:23:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> well i think i resolved like 4 tickets this morning
[11:24:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> nice
[11:24:43 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> openTIckets--;
[11:25:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is everything important that needs to go into 3.0.1 marked with that fix version?
[11:25:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'd found some stuff in the uncategorized bucket and moved them in, but i'm not sure if i missed anything
[11:27:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm not sure what to tell dave about his logging issue
[11:37:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> wow I didn't realize just how bad the ldap examples were
[11:37:09 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (sad)
[11:37:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> athena7: yeah I'm not sure I get what he's trying to do
[11:37:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[11:37:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> they're really confusing, huh (smile)
[11:37:38 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[11:37:43 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i made a ticket for changing those - i can pull in some useful examples from the docs
[11:37:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that would be good
[11:37:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yep
[11:38:13 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> if we could get your or Marks (or both) as samples in security.properies and ldapContext.xml
[11:39:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah i've been thinking too about how to make sure that the examples don't confuse the person dir and security context ldap configurations
[11:39:58 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is there really any reason to keep the alias in there?
[11:40:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it kind of seems like it just adds confusion
[11:40:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> nope
[11:40:44 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> well other than I think if you configure a LDAP server you need one to be named 'defaultLdapServer'
[11:41:05 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
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[11:42:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> right
[11:42:12 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> might just be clearer to name it "defaultLdapServer"
[11:42:40 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[11:49:55 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> should the default person directory connection configuration be pooled?
[11:50:16 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> pooled ldap or cached persondir?
[11:51:07 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> not sure what pooled persondir is
[11:51:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sorry
[11:51:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (smile)
[11:51:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> the ldap connection bean configuration
[11:51:23 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ah
[11:51:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> probably not
[11:51:40 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> definetaly not with the JDK pooling
[11:51:48 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which is what that 'pool' attribute sets
[11:52:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and with the pooling context source (that we wrote at UW) it is actually slower
[11:52:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ok, cool
[11:52:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> though it does reduce load on the ldap server
[11:52:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that was one of those things where a manager said 'we must pool ldap to make it faster'
[11:53:05 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and even after testing and saying 'pooling with validation is slower than no pooling' we did it anyways (tongue)
[11:55:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> lol
[11:55:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sad
[11:55:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i mean it's not funny, but
[11:55:47 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (smile)
[11:55:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I know (smile)
[11:55:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it did make our ldap admins happy though
[11:56:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and it really isn't much slower ... maybe 1%
[11:56:17 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> but it is extra complexity
[11:58:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[11:58:52 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> sorry, I have been away trying to write something down for Dave ... not sure if it will be of any help
[11:59:00 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> plus people have to know that they can't use the same ldap connection for authn
[11:59:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ok, i just committed some config file updates, if anyone wants to look them over and see if they make sense
[11:59:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> thanks
[11:59:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'll take a peak
[11:59:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i've looked at all this stuff for so long i'm not sure i can converse sensibly about it anymore (smile)
[11:59:27 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I didn't touch security.properties or ldapContext.xml, Eric
[11:59:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oh yeah you're doing LDAP via CAS
[11:59:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> this of course is the trick
[12:00:02 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> you can do LDAP directly
[12:00:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> or LDAP via CAS
[12:01:32 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yes, two separate cases I guess
[12:02:04 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> this was a semi-expected consequence of bundling CAS though ... oh well
[12:02:21 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> well, nice job though
[12:02:28 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> it really does work
[12:03:16 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (smile)
[12:04:19 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I think the temptation is probably to try to do too much at one time (when you are just evaluating)
[12:05:04 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:05:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and well much of the authn config is not well documented
[12:06:19 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> there are a lot of different scenarios for that
[12:06:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:06:49 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:07:00 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and since I know it the back of my head that we're going to be switching to spring-security
[12:07:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:07:10 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it makes me less motivated to document what we have now
[12:07:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> well, for the cause auth stuff, i guess we could provide some basic documentation, then refer to the CAS manual for more
[12:07:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:07:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> thats what it does right now
[12:08:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm hoping what i added here will be close enough for now for the local ldap auth stuff: http://www.ja-sig.org/wiki/display/UPM30/04+Authenticating+Against+LDAP
[12:08:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there's interesting random issues too
[12:09:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> like you need potentially need to import the certificate for the server itself if you're using uportal and cas over ssl
[12:09:17 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> speaking for the unknowing ... it would be nice to have the simplest cases documented so that evaluators can get up an running as quickly as possible
[12:09:23 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> since even though they might be on the same server, that doesn't really matter if the cert is not trusted by the jvm
[12:09:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i agree mark
[12:09:36 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yes
[12:09:54 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and having those as the included example as well
[12:10:02 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> athena7: yeah the SSL issues are a whole other can of worms
[12:10:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> the CAS stuff in the uportal manual needs an update
[12:10:23 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> luckily they are also pretty consistent across any Java + SSL situtation
[12:10:48 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:12:55 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> XML can be/seem a bit verbose and difficult to read
[12:13:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> http://www.ja-sig.org/wiki/display/UPM30/03+Changing+your+Portal%27s+hostname
[12:13:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> just saw that (smile)
[12:13:30 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> does that seem right?
[12:13:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'm going to test it right now
[12:13:49 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[12:16:36 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> looks like the jquery ui 1.4b is out now
[12:16:48 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> cool
[12:17:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> not sure what timeframe we want to upgrade on
[12:17:14 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i guess it might be more efficient to wait until after the 3.0.1 release
[12:17:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> unless there are bug fixes I don't think we'd do it for 3.0.1
[12:17:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> maybe wait for the full 1.5 release
[12:17:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there are a lot of bug fixes
[12:17:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> some of which affect us most likely
[12:17:33 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ah
[12:17:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> but there are new features too, and it looks like a lot has changed
[12:17:47 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> so i don't want to accidentally introduce new problems
[12:17:50 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hrm
[12:17:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:18:00 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that sounds like it might need a discussion on the dev list
[12:18:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:18:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> as to if it is a patch or a minor change
[12:18:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there's whole new effects libraries and all sorts of stuff
[12:18:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> as to if we just stay with what we have in 3.0
[12:18:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i think we should probably wait
[12:18:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and do it for 3.1
[12:18:31 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:18:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which should include fluid
[12:18:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> plus then we can upgrade to the released version
[12:18:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[12:18:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so we'll likely be doing it anyways there
[12:18:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'd like to maybe at least rename the files though
[12:19:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> filename.js -> filename-1.5b1.js or whatever
[12:19:15 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and then put a longterm cache expiration on them
[12:19:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> as per our discussion on list
[12:19:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it would make it more clear what version we're using of stuff anyway
[12:19:54 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:20:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> perhaps just put the version # in the dir name
[12:20:24 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the long-term cache headers stuff will need some documentation
[12:20:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and lots of testing
[12:20:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> since that can cause painful problems for people if done incorrectly
[12:29:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> well, i think the long-term cache headers should be safe enough for our external libraries
[12:29:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:29:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i mean, it would be confusing and impossible to make select edits to those anyway
[12:29:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> since they're already minified in the uportal source code
[12:29:54 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> true
[12:30:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> what you can't read those? (wink)
[12:30:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> hehe
[12:30:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i can barely even open them in some of my editors
[12:30:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> that much stuff on one line makes them very sad
[12:30:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hrm ...
[12:30:43 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i kind of like the idea of putting the version in the dir name
[12:30:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> have you run an initportal on your mac from the trunk lately?
[12:30:58 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> saves us the trouble of renaming them all
[12:31:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> not for about a week maybe
[12:31:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> what's happening?
[12:31:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> just got Caused by: java.lang.UnsupportedClassVersionError: Bad version number in .class file
[12:31:26 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> while crn-import was running
[12:31:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> now I need to track down what dep is in a repository and compiled for JDK6
[12:31:47 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (tongue)
[12:34:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah
[12:35:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> java 1.6 seems to have appeared for macs
[12:35:18 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it appeared in my software updates last night
[12:35:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:35:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> been out for a little while
[12:35:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah but i don' tthink it was in the autodownload was it?
[12:35:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and it won't trample over your jdk5 instance
[12:35:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> very nice
[12:37:29 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> could you do a ls ~/.m2/repository/javax/script/script-api/1.0/ for me?
[12:37:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and tell me the .jars you have in there?
[12:38:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oops, now mine is broken too (smile)
[12:38:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i just had to go and be curious
[12:38:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> same error?
[12:38:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yep
[12:38:46 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> Leopard only
[12:38:51 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> have you done the jdk6 install?
[12:38:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah last night
[12:39:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i haven't enabled it though
[12:39:05 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I really hope that didn't break things ...
[12:39:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> you've had that update for a while though haven't you?
[12:40:04 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:40:10 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> but I haven't done a uPortal build for a while
[12:40:16 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I don't do much dev on my personal laptop
[12:40:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah
[12:40:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i typically do initportals every couple days at the minimum
[12:40:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> frequently multiple times a day
[12:40:55 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:40:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I do to
[12:41:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> just at work (smile)
[12:41:09 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah gotcha
[12:41:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ok well this is bad
[12:41:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> now i can't do any work on up3 (tongue)
[12:41:29 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> what does an initportal do for you?
[12:41:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> Caused by: java.lang.UnsupportedClassVersionError: Bad version number in .class file
[12:41:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:42:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> MarkRogers: does a full deploy including droping and recreating the database
[12:42:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> very handy when you develop on trunk since things change
[12:42:54 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> 'ant clean initportal' is what I run quite frequently when doing trunk development
[12:43:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ensure you don't have any remenants of old versions sitting around
[12:45:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> wtf apple
[12:45:09 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> apple.applescript.AppleScriptEngineFactory
[12:45:15 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that is the class it is failing to load
[12:45:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so the JDK6 install does much with JDK5 settings
[12:45:29 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> GAH!
[12:46:21 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> guess Steve can't say "it just works" with that one
[12:46:32 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> haha
[12:46:44 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> apple always f's up the jdk updates
[12:46:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> always.
[12:47:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> that's why i didn't install it until it got pushed out
[12:47:02 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so I'm guessing by installing JDK6 it registered the applescript engine globally?
[12:47:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> figures that i got bitten anyway (tongue)
[12:47:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> but that engine is compiled for JDK6
[12:47:17 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so fails on JDK5
[12:47:19 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> have the internets gotten angry yet?
[12:47:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> wonderful
[12:47:22 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[12:47:26 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> going to look now ...
[12:47:32 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> this one might take longer to crop up
[12:47:41 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> my favorite was when they totally broke java a couple years ago
[12:47:55 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and the recommended diagnostic was to try a java --version
[12:48:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and if it core dumped, then yes, you were affected
[12:48:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> wha?
[12:48:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lol
[12:49:06 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> just run OpenSolaris in a VM
[12:49:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hah
[12:49:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah ok (tongue)
[12:50:27 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> then you can just hit F14 if you really need your Mac (smile)
[12:50:31 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ah i see why i just got the release - only for 64 bit machines
[12:52:15 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> that's not such a good sign that it's been out for a couple weeks without being fixed
[12:59:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> so any suggestions?
[12:59:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> dunno
[12:59:59 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I'm going to try running it from JDK6 in eclipse
[13:00:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and then post to the apple dev forums
[13:00:26 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> maybe figure out how to register/deregister script engines?
[13:01:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sounds good
[13:01:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> my development is going to be pretty cripped in the meantime, bleh
[13:07:44 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah switching to JDK6 seems to fix it (tongue)
[13:08:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> did you use the java preferences thing?
[13:08:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it doesn't seem to have switched my command-line java version
[13:08:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I just did it in eclipse
[13:08:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I haven't switched os wide
[13:08:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> did you restart terminal?
[13:09:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[13:09:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> could try a reboot
[13:09:04 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> weird
[13:09:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i can't run the build in eclipse though
[13:09:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i guess i could if i changed ant in there
[13:09:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah I just ran the cerunnos Main class for my test
[13:11:46 EDT(-0400)] * deuce_ (n=deuce@uni1.unicon.net) has joined ##uportal
[13:15:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20060121171126988
[13:17:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[13:17:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hrm
[13:17:48 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that doesn't work for me either (tongue)
[13:18:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah that's more or less how i dealt w/ the 1.5 upgrad
[13:18:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> trying to figure out what's wrong
[13:18:46 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> apple really needs to stop doing java stuff
[13:18:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes.
[13:22:49 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> looks like they might be using current now instead of currentjdk
[13:22:55 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[13:22:59 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which points to A
[13:23:05 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which is ... an actual dir
[13:23:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[13:23:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm currently confused by that as well
[13:23:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and I have no idea how to 'fix' that
[13:23:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i don't remember that
[13:23:23 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> http://blogs.sun.com/cmar/entry/java_1_6_finally_available
[13:23:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sounds like ti'd work
[13:23:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> not sure about the side effects
[13:23:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hrm
[13:23:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> probably need to switch the whole Current
[13:23:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> dir
[13:23:58 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> brb
[13:25:55 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah, aliasing current instead at least gets the version right
[13:27:50 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[13:28:14 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ok
[13:28:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ant initportal working now
[13:28:28 EDT(-0400)] * athena7 sighs
[13:28:31 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeh
[13:28:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> sudo rm Current
[13:28:37 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm nervous about compiling everything under 1.6
[13:28:40 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> sudo ln -s 1.6 Current
[13:28:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[13:28:47 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I can find the bad JAR now
[13:29:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is having us develop under 1.6 going to cause sadness and pain down the line?
[13:29:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> no
[13:29:41 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I do it at work
[13:29:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the pom is set to build for JDK 1.5
[13:30:12 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so all of the distributions of 3.0 were actually built on 1.6
[13:31:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> ok, good
[13:31:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i won't worry then
[13:31:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so reading up on the scripting stuff
[13:32:12 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> Java discovers the available engines via the jar service provider spec
[13:32:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so the applescript jar is ending up in the classpath somehow
[13:32:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[13:33:14 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> did that last line with the .jar come through?
[13:33:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oh wait
[13:33:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> duh
[13:33:23 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> /System/Library/Java/Extensions/AppleScriptEngine.jar
[13:33:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> there we go
[13:34:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> http://wiki.objectstyle.org/confluence/display/WOL/Problems+Building+after+JDK+1.6+Install
[13:34:53 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> http://www.techienuggets.com/CommentDetail?tx=63284
[13:34:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> uhg
[13:34:56 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> is that anything like the "$JAVA_HOME/jre/lib/ext" dir of a linux/windows jdk install
[13:35:00 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[13:35:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> except it isn't JDK version specific
[13:35:11 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> if you put .jars in there, they are automatically in the class loader
[13:35:13 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it is shared by ALL JDKs on the system
[13:35:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so when they give you JDK6
[13:35:32 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> they stick a JAR in there that is compiled for JDK6
[13:35:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so anything from an earlier JDK that tries to load it ... fails
[13:35:49 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> mv /System/Library/Java/Extensions/AppleScriptEngine.jar /broken.jar
[13:36:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I REALLY dislike Apple doing JDKs
[13:36:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> brb again
[13:38:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> now that I have the right google search: http://www.google.com/search?q=AppleScriptEngine.jar
[13:38:22 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lots of people have hit this
[13:39:40 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> ah
[13:39:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> here we go
[13:39:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> sudo mv /System/Library/Java/Extensions/AppleScriptEngine.jar /System/Library/Frameworks/JavaVM.framework/Versions/1.6.0/Home/lib/ext
[13:40:13 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> i like my version better
[13:40:16 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> (smile)
[13:41:06 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> so that gets it loaded by 1.6 but not other versions?
[13:41:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[13:41:44 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which would seem like the sane thing for apple to do anyeays
[13:42:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[13:42:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sounds good
[13:42:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i may leave my default version 1.6
[13:42:23 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> since iv'e been wanting to play with it anyway
[13:42:35 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i just didn't want to do the update before because i was convinced they'd screw it up
[13:42:39 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and of course they did (smile)
[13:43:52 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh argh
[13:44:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> clearly eclipse didn't like that at all
[13:44:01 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oh
[13:44:11 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> you have to change CurrentJDK too
[13:44:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i did
[13:44:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> looks like there's a jdkRequired=1.5 string in the config
[13:44:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> you may also need to re-detect installed JDKs in eclipse
[13:45:10 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> doesn't launch (smile)
[13:45:26 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> oops
[13:47:31 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> heh.
[13:47:38 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> eclipse didn't work until i linked current back to A
[13:47:43 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> 1.5 wasn't good enough
[13:47:44 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> uhg
[13:47:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> awesome huh?
[13:47:59 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[13:48:14 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> ubunut
[13:48:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> is that like a peanut? (smile)
[13:48:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> mmm edible linux
[13:48:46 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> sorry, typo
[13:48:54 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> one word, will fix your mac jvm problems
[13:48:56 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> (wink)
[13:48:57 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> ubuntu
[13:49:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i think everything is fixed now - set it back to 1.5 and A and moved the jar
[13:51:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> added the new jvm to eclipse
[13:51:18 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> think everything is right with the world again
[13:51:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> well, maybe not from holdorph's perspective (smile)
[13:51:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it's ok cris, you can insult my mac in person in a couple weeks
[13:51:55 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> yeah, i probably wouldn't use 'right'
[13:52:17 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> why you waiting to come in the triple-digit heat?
[13:52:17 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> hey I agree ... ubuntu is a much better dev platform
[13:52:29 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> i think this is the last week of low 90's
[13:52:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[13:52:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and it sucks because the weather is beautiful here right now
[13:53:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> not like in august, where phx could easily be nicer than ct
[14:02:09 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i tried to make a joke about not knowing the difference between California and Arizona and the guy (from California) got really angry
[14:02:35 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> lol, seriously?
[14:02:44 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> wow, that says so much about californians
[14:03:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> lol
[14:03:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> where in cali was he from?
[14:03:47 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i used to joke about az just being a big exburb of california (tongue)
[14:03:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there's some truth to it
[14:04:18 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> last time i was in az they were advertising magic mountain (near LA) as being conveniently in the area
[14:05:07 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> lol
[14:05:35 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> although I do drive to vegas, about 6 hours from my house, every time i go, so 6 hour drive to LA is within reason for me
[14:06:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[14:06:39 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i used to regard a 5 hour drive as a quick weekend trip
[14:06:51 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> now people talk about going to dc, which is about 5 hours away, and consider flying
[14:06:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> cuz it's like, really far
[14:07:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> of course, having to drive through northeast corridor traffic makes it potentially further - i've had the trip range from 4.5 hours to over 10
[14:07:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> my mother once forbid me to drive to san diego "for the day" (smile)
[14:08:00 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> yeah, driving through 300+ miles of rush-hour equivalent traffice would be a nightmare
[14:08:08 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[14:08:18 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it's not terrible the whole way, but the nyc area can be a nasty mess
[14:08:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and it's a big area
[14:08:36 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i usually just skirt nyc and take the tappan zee
[14:08:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i like that bridge anyway
[14:08:51 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> the first time i went over it i hadn't been out of az long and i was shocked to see that much water
[14:09:47 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> growing up in michigan, i'm used to the 'more water then the eye can see'
[14:10:02 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> even if the great lakes aren't as big as the ocean, you'd never know it from standing on the beach.
[14:10:05 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[14:10:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i grew up in coastal cities
[14:10:14 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> then in mn
[14:10:19 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> arizona was really a chagne
[14:10:39 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> wow, that's some diversity
[14:10:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i was not particularly excited about moving to the desert at the time (smile)
[14:10:52 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i thought it was going to be all sand like the sahara, with some big rocks or something
[14:10:53 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> lol
[14:10:55 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah i moved around a lot
[14:11:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> well, i was 15, i'm not sure i'd really thought through it in depth (smile)
[14:11:15 EDT(-0400)] <holdorph> well there's moving around, but you also managed like different climates too
[14:12:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes
[14:12:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> seattle, florida, minnesota, az, then college in ct
[14:12:52 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there were a few states before that but i don't remember them well
[14:22:49 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> I guess your next stop will be up here, in the Great White North
[14:22:58 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> haha
[14:23:06 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i dated someone in ottawa for a couple years
[14:23:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it's a nice place
[14:23:46 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> Ottawa doesn't really count
[14:23:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> lol
[14:23:58 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> what counts?
[14:27:33 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> My wife loves NYC
[14:28:25 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> and my daughter ... because there is an American Girl store there.
[14:28:57 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> did you read my note on uportal-user?
[14:31:28 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> which one?
[14:31:36 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> on CAS-LDAP
[14:32:11 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lists seem to be slow again (tongue)
[14:32:14 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> a couple hours ago with the documentation?
[14:32:34 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yeah
[14:32:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yep, looked great (smile)
[14:33:14 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> okay thanks. I wasn't sure if it would be helpful for him
[14:33:41 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> no that was wonderful
[14:33:48 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i was thinking of wiki'izing it
[14:34:00 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> what is the theory behind the wiki numbering
[14:34:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yes i was about to suggest it'd be a great addition to the manual
[14:34:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> numbering?
[14:34:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> order
[14:34:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the wiki alphabatizes child pages
[14:34:58 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> the number beside the name - like 05 Authentication
[14:35:15 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> so just for ordering?
[14:35:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[14:35:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> though I suppose if we formalized it a bit more
[14:35:37 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it could be easier to point people to it
[14:35:42 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> like 'go read 5.2'
[14:36:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> parts of me really like the wiki as a manual
[14:36:15 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> i think it's great
[14:36:31 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> especially with copying the space for each release (eg there will be a new space for 3.1) but there are some features that could make it better
[14:36:45 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> like auto-assigning outline style numbering to pages
[14:36:52 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> have a nice automatic TOC
[14:37:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and inserting a page wouldn't be such a pain
[14:39:05 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> so this CAS stuff we've been talking about would, to me, be more like an entry in a "recipes" book rather than a part of the manual, but some of it also perhaps belongs in the manual
[14:39:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I think a recipes section in the manual would be good
[14:40:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> sounds good to me
[14:42:02 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> yes, I think Andrew has added some pages like that
[14:42:40 EDT(-0400)] <MarkRogers> something he'd probably seen asked many times and then someone answers the question in a nice way and he wiki'izes it
[14:43:21 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah I need to get better at doing that
[14:58:33 EDT(-0400)] * EiNZTEiN_ (n=einztein@205.241.143.4) has joined ##uportal

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