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[12:16:40 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Wow, getting Oracle to work with the service name urls instead of SID is not as fun as I thought it would be
[12:17:28 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lol
[12:18:00 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> the short form never seemed to work, but all I had to do was use jdbc:oracle:thin:@(DESCRIPTION=(ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=TCP)(HOST=esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu)(PORT=1521))(CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=portal1.esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu)))
[12:18:06 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> see how easy that was?
[12:18:11 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> o_0
[12:18:12 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> LOL
[12:19:21 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I have no idea why jdbc:oracle:thin:esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu:1521/portal1.esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu wouldn't work
[12:20:32 EDT(-0400)] * pberry blames Oracle
[12:20:42 EDT(-0400)] <athena> lol
[12:21:25 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> So, I have to say that not having touched uPortal since 2.6, 3.2.x brings a lot of changes
[12:21:40 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> But I'm guessing y'all already get that
[12:21:42 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> 
[12:21:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yeah i saw you had a couple comments in chat after i left the other night
[12:22:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena> you said a test was broken?
[12:22:19 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> oh yeah, the filesystemgroupthingy
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[12:22:44 EDT(-0400)] <athena> was it just printing out an error or was it actually failing?
[12:22:55 EDT(-0400)] <athena> and yes, ant 1.7.1 is the required version 
[12:22:55 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> it would fail
[12:23:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena> that i haven't seen in 3.2.x
[12:23:05 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> one sec
[12:23:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena> though i think i remember someone saying it was a problem in trunk, or something like that
[12:23:39 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I'm using a stock 3.2.1 download
[12:23:44 EDT(-0400)] <athena> also pberry, we're in the middle of totally redoing the uportal manual
[12:23:51 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> gotcha
[12:23:52 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so most of the pages don't actually exist for the 3.2 version
[12:23:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena> tho
[12:23:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena> ug
[12:23:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena> h
[12:24:01 EDT(-0400)] <athena> though most of the 3.1 manual is still applicable
[12:24:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so if there's stuff that's missing, i'd recommend looking in the 3.1 version
[12:24:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i know it sucks 
[12:24:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena> but if you run across stuff that's different in 3.1 vs. 3.2 let me know and i'll try to prioritize documenting that before other things
[12:25:09 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I'll try and keep you posted on my progress
[12:25:23 EDT(-0400)] <athena> awesome - would be good to know what we're missing
[12:25:28 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I also heard that our neighbor CSU Sacramento is upgrading from 2.6 to 3.2
[12:25:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena> there's actually a 3.2 documentation JIRA you can comment on too
[12:25:41 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> ah, sweet
[12:25:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena> oh neat
[12:25:53 EDT(-0400)] <athena> and yeah, a lot has changed
[12:25:56 EDT(-0400)] <athena> especially w/ the UI
[12:25:59 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> and Chico is looking at 3.2
[12:26:03 EDT(-0400)] <athena> awesome!
[12:26:22 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> although, I'm supposed to do thing about "what's the future of portal" and evaluate other solutions
[12:26:33 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> includingâ¦PeopleSoft Portal
[12:26:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena> ah, thus the liferay comment
[12:26:36 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> yeah...
[12:26:57 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> See, we can still get PS Portal "for free" (because our time has no value obviously)
[12:27:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i don't know much about peoplesoft
[12:27:42 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> it's big and scary
[12:27:47 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i'd imagine so
[12:27:51 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> When you see it coming, run the other way. Fast.
[12:27:54 EDT(-0400)] <athena> hehe
[12:28:10 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> It's like all the worst parts of the Matrix basically
[12:28:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena> wow, that's quite a statement
[12:28:55 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I'm all about hyperbole.
[12:29:02 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> It's the best thing ever.
[12:29:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena> hehe
[12:29:15 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so in two weeks i'm going to be on the west coast
[12:29:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so i won't miss your questions at night anymore!
[12:30:21 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> nice (for me)
[12:30:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena> for me too
[12:30:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena>
[12:30:51 EDT(-0400)] <athena> well i hope chico stays w/ uportal, of course
[12:30:58 EDT(-0400)] <athena> 3.2 has some shiny
[12:31:14 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> yeah, our portal story is a bit different from most places
[12:31:53 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> The biggie is that portal is not optional for folks. It's the only way to get to PeopleSoft, thus it's the only way to register for classes. So, captive audience in a way.
[12:32:09 EDT(-0400)] <athena> ah, gotcha
[12:32:15 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Butâ¦we've seen that people come to the portal mainly to get to other places, not hang out.
[12:32:45 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that's what we see too pberry
[12:32:48 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> We don't pull a lot of information into the portal either, mainly because any source we want to pull from isn't highly available
[12:32:57 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> our average clicks-in-portal is like 1.85
[12:33:11 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> yeah.
[12:33:20 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which is what we target so that's good
[12:33:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yeah, i though your presentation about that at the unconference was awesome EricDalquist
[12:33:32 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I've actually been able to sell the idea that this is a measure of success for the portal
[12:33:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it will probably go down when we let people pick their own home tab
[12:33:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:33:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i think universities are sort of unique in that regard
[12:33:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> people want to log in and see exactly what they care about
[12:33:51 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and move on
[12:33:59 EDT(-0400)] <athena> a lot of portal products are tailored to the expectation that you want to keep people in the portal
[12:34:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena> lots of content, etc.
[12:34:06 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so you can sell ads or whatever
[12:34:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena> most people don't really set uportal up that way
[12:34:32 EDT(-0400)] <athena> want more to have a way to make all the squirrely corners of campus IT easy to get to
[12:34:32 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Task 1: I need to get to the LMS. Task 2: I need to get to Google Apps. Task 3: I need to get to PeopleSoft.
[12:34:36 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> That's really it...
[12:34:58 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:35:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and we do lots of dashboard views
[12:35:06 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and are trying to get more
[12:35:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> so they can see summaries of their destinations to decide if they actually need to go there or not
[12:35:25 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> We also don't have enough attributes in LDAP to do the kind of targeting that folks on campus want to do
[12:35:36 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> which isn't a portal problem per seâ¦it's IdM
[12:35:39 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yeah
[12:35:43 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that is always hard
[12:35:51 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> group A says "we want to show this to all advisors"
[12:36:01 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> and you say "define advisors"
[12:36:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> we say ... that's easy! Once you can tell us how to identify who is an advisor
[12:36:06 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> and they blink and stare at you
[12:36:08 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[12:36:17 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> that's where we are
[12:36:24 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and then 18 months later they can tell you about 90% of the time who an advisor is 
[12:36:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena> lol yeah
[12:36:36 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so typical of higher ed
[12:36:42 EDT(-0400)] <athena> we had a lot of those same conversations at yale
[12:36:51 EDT(-0400)] <athena> and complex behaviors around what happens when people have multiple roles, etc.
[12:36:51 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> ad hoc and corner cases are the norm
[12:37:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena> so many more traditional portals really expect the answers to those questions to be easy, and for all the data to come from one place
[12:37:14 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Then IT comes in with a system and wants to impose rules and stuff. We look like the bad guys...
[12:37:39 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> It's amazing how hard it is to get people to agree on what a student is
[12:37:47 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> We're a school, right?
[12:37:51 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> We should know this, right?
[12:38:39 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> So, is everyone still using svn?
[12:39:04 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> We've migrated all our stuff to git, and it's amazing
[12:39:23 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> (especially the svn compatibility layer)
[12:39:40 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yes, we're still using svn
[12:39:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena> though i hear more and more people mentioning git
[12:39:56 EDT(-0400)] <athena> dunno if that's something we should start thinking about more seriously
[12:40:16 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Yeah, not sure
[12:40:34 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I talked to the Apache prez at JASIG and he said a lot of git stuff was coming to svn "soon"
[12:40:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena> interesting
[12:40:58 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> basically git makes branching cheap and merging easy
[12:41:11 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yeah
[12:41:16 EDT(-0400)] <athena> we use svnmerge, and it works ok
[12:41:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena> without it life would suck
[12:41:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena> with it, it's mostly ok but not brilliant
[12:41:31 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> everybody makes a big deal about it being distributed, but the merging is just awesome
[12:41:38 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I don't fear branches anymore
[12:41:45 EDT(-0400)] <athena> nice
[12:42:21 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> check out http://nvie.com/git-model sometime
[12:42:26 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yeah i'll have to do that
[12:42:32 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> Of course, IDE integration is an issue
[12:42:42 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i wondered about that
[12:42:47 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I don't use IDEA or Eclipse, so not that big a deal for me
[12:42:56 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> athena: once we're on contegix hosting we'll be on svn 1.6
[12:43:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena> what about other GUI clients?
[12:43:03 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> which has svnmerge type stuff built in
[12:43:07 EDT(-0400)] <athena> oh that's great EricDalquist
[12:43:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i suspect we drive a few of our UE developers insane every time we do something new with source control
[12:43:54 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> without change we'd still be using cvs
[12:44:31 EDT(-0400)] <athena> yes
[12:44:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena> gotta move when it's worth it
[12:44:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena> but it does help to have good GUI clients for the devs that don't spend as much time on the command line
[12:45:24 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> truth
[12:56:10 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> wow, I'm dumb
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[12:56:20 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> @JASIGLogBot don't log that!
[12:56:34 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lol
[12:56:35 EDT(-0400)] <athena> lol
[12:56:41 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I was missing the @ in my jdbc url
[12:56:45 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> jdbc:oracle:thin:@esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu:1521/portal1.esys-oracle1.csuchico.edu
[12:56:47 EDT(-0400)] * athena schemes to make that a top google hit
[12:57:03 EDT(-0400)] <awills> lol... i'm reading that from the wiki next time I have to introduce you at a Jasig conference
[12:57:08 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I'm already #1 for "Pat Berry is dumb"
[12:57:37 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> "Hi, this is Pat Berry. He's dumb."
[13:00:37 EDT(-0400)] <awills> "This is Pat Berry... he yealls orders at the JASIGLogBot"
[13:01:16 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I, for one, will welcome our robot overlords.
[13:01:18 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> you could always go patch the logbot code to allow command & control
[13:01:19 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist>
[13:01:24 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> it is in the jasig svn repo
[13:01:37 EDT(-0400)] <awills> nice
[13:01:46 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> I'll just write up a project plan and delegate instead
[13:01:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> lol
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[14:15:32 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> athena:
[14:15:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> the two minimized urls
[14:15:39 EDT(-0400)]
[14:15:46 EDT(-0400)]
[14:15:53 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> that save=all is what causes it to actually persist
[14:17:18 EDT(-0400)] <athena> thanks!
[14:17:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena> much appreciated
[14:25:35 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> yup
[14:25:49 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> and did you take a look at the patch to see what the changes do?
[14:29:25 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> awills1: did you see those build issues from the security context patch?
[14:34:06 EDT(-0400)] <awills1> no... on the phone atm
[14:34:23 EDT(-0400)] <EricDalquist> I think it may just be an errant @Overides
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[16:58:45 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> gah, how do you get initportal to not try and do all the cas stuff. I'm commented out the cas module in the portlets-overlay pom
[17:04:04 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> nm
[17:04:12 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> was doing dumb stuff in parent pom
[17:04:20 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> had cas-server.version commented out
[17:04:22 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> that's bad
[17:05:25 EDT(-0400)] <athena> pberry: i wrote up some instructions at the bottom of this page - http://www.ja-sig.org/wiki/display/UPM32/CAS
[17:05:30 EDT(-0400)] <athena> let me know if there's missing bits?
[17:05:42 EDT(-0400)] <athena> i'm heading out for now, but i'll check logs later
[17:05:48 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> no worries
[17:05:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena> or feel free to email/twitter/whatever
[17:05:58 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> is fixed now
[17:06:00 EDT(-0400)] <athena> would love to get some testers of what little documentation we have
[17:06:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena> ah, cool
[17:06:13 EDT(-0400)] <athena> have a good weekend!
[17:06:15 EDT(-0400)] <pberry> you too!
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